how to get Gaia and Caltopo to play nice?

ecojoy's Avatar

ecojoy

25 Feb, 2020 01:51 AM

Hi,
Been a Gaia user for some time and trying to upload a complex map and route made in Caltopo. Has perhaps 300 waypoints and 300 routes. Also around 700 miles distance. (attached)
Is there a recommended way to go about that?
Alternatively, is Caltopo Mobile something that could be used instead of Gaia, with all the bells and whistles they have?
Cheers
David

  1. Support Staff 1 Posted by rmarcucci on 25 Feb, 2020 02:21 AM

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    David,

    I know this probably isn't a satisfactory answer, but I'd reach out to Gaia for compatibility questions with their app. The file itself looks fine, it is just absolutely enormous, so I imagine that is the issue. I've had no problems importing significantly smaller tracks from CalTopo to Gaia in the past. You may just need to break it up, or use an online gpx processor to remove some points.

    Our new app is really seamless between desktop and mobile. I'm obviously biased, but it works great and I love it! You can try it for free via the app store or google play, though you will need a subscription to download maps for offline use. Have a great time on the Hayduke, be safe, and be in touch if you have any further questions.

    All the best,
    Rom

  2. rmarcucci closed this discussion on 25 Feb, 2020 02:21 AM.

  3. ecojoy re-opened this discussion on 25 Feb, 2020 08:26 AM

  4. 2 Posted by ecojoy on 25 Feb, 2020 08:26 AM

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    Hi Rom,

    Thanks for your suggestion. I did reach out to Gaia and they suggested, as you did, to work with an online GPX processor (GPS Track Editor <http://www.gpstrackeditor.com/> ).

    Would that be needed if using the caltopo app as well?

     

    I will look into the mobile app. Will having a subscription at the “pro” level work better at getting files to load faster on the mobile?

     

    My hiking partner is not at the Pro subscription level, and had this to say about the experience of uploading maps.

    Any suggestions to address her quandary?

     

    I am currently working on trying to see how the CalTopo App works. I think I’ve been able to download all the necessary tiles for the 1st half. I had to do it manually and it was a huge pain in the butt trying to match up what tiles were necessary as the app won’t allow the route to be overlayed on what needs to be downloaded to work off-line. Now that I think of it, I suspect I am running into a similar problem. CalTopo will only let me upload 2G at a time, which is quite a small area considering the entire length of the trail.

     

    Cheers,
    David

  5. Support Staff 3 Posted by rmarcucci on 25 Feb, 2020 10:04 PM

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    David,

    I just loaded it up on my phone. Takes about 5 seconds to load as it is so massive.

    A pro level won't affect download speed, just which features you have access to. Download speed will be affected by the speed of your device and connection.
    information is here: https://caltopo.com/about/pricing/individual-accounts/

    I have never done a thru of that length, but it seems like most folks will split up their track into more manageable chunks anyway, often into segments between resupplies it seems.

    Regarding your partner's experience, has she tried lately? We went away from limiting the amount of downloads. I hear you on the tracks not showing on the downloader, but the base map does show up, so while not exact, it has been relatively easy for me to match up. When you swap from where you are on the map screen to the download screen, it remains centered as well, which helps.

    All the best,
    Rom

  6. rmarcucci closed this discussion on 25 Feb, 2020 10:04 PM.

  7. ecojoy re-opened this discussion on 26 Feb, 2020 10:02 PM

  8. 4 Posted by ecojoy on 26 Feb, 2020 10:02 PM

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    Hi Rom,

     

    All is good. I cut the map in half and am happy to discover the notation remains if downloaded via GeoJson. (https://caltopo.com/m/HR76)

     

    It is tough to see which tiles I needed to download, and missed a few the first time, but it downloads fast and well.

    (be interesting to know where those are downloaded to so I can delete afterwards). My download were with scanned 7.5 and Mapbulder overlay.

     

    Regarding my hiking partner’s experience, yes, she just recently tried to get the tiles. Found she had to do it tile by tile.

     

    One big question-does the mobile app have a route recorder? Be good to be able to turn that on and off as needed.

     

    Cheers

    David

  9. Support Staff 5 Posted by rmarcucci on 26 Feb, 2020 10:41 PM

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    David,

    Great to hear! The tiles are fairly small, but if you truly need to free up your space here is how it works:

    For offline layers, you can access the .mbtiles files using iTunes or your phone's file browser, and either delete them or move them to your computer so you can re-install at a later date. The files are named as {layer}-{resolution}-{lat}-{lng}-{sublat}{sublng}.

    On Android, All the downloaded maps are accessible under Android/data/com.caltopo.android/files/tiles

    To make a track, bottom right 4 dots, record track.

    All the best,
    Rom

  10. rmarcucci closed this discussion on 26 Feb, 2020 10:41 PM.

  11. ecojoy re-opened this discussion on 26 Feb, 2020 11:10 PM

  12. 6 Posted by ecojoy on 26 Feb, 2020 11:10 PM

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    Hi Rom,

    Thanks for this info. Found the files! Thanks

    Be interesting if file location could be put to SD card?

     

    My app shows a satellite dish. Clicking on that, show the ability to record.

    Will test out now and in medium power settings on Airplane mode!

    Crossing fingers

    Cheers

    David

  13. Support Staff 7 Posted by rmarcucci on 27 Feb, 2020 12:31 AM

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    David,

    You should be able to move them to an SD card. Watch the power settings. It's a bit hard to say as there are so many versions of Android and phones, but sometimes when the power is being restricted Android will kill the app and your track will stop recording. You may need to adjust your settings if this happens.

    All the best,
    Rom

  14. rmarcucci closed this discussion on 27 Feb, 2020 12:31 AM.

  15. ecojoy re-opened this discussion on 27 Feb, 2020 05:46 AM

  16. 8 Posted by ecojoy on 27 Feb, 2020 05:46 AM

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    Hi Rom,

    I think I’ll leave well enough alone for the time being. Thanks for the info on where I can find them.

    I was successful at testing track recording-at Medium Power (something that Gaia cant do)

    Is there a Manual that I could review on how to use the Caltopo Mobile app?

    Things that might answer questions like:

    1. Marking a waypoint?

    2. Direction finding (is there an arrow that can be used to find the way forward, connected with phone position (similar to Gaia system)?

    3. A means to estimate distances (scale)

    4. How to update the track I just made to my Caltopo maps?

     

    Cheers

    David

  17. Support Staff 9 Posted by rmarcucci on 27 Feb, 2020 02:30 PM

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    David,

    1. We don't have great documentation on the app right now, as it is still in beta and has been changing constantly. We're actually hiring someone to make it, among other things, if you know a good candidate: http://caltopo.com/about/2020/02/14/caltopo-is-hiring/
    2. We are in the middle of a big push to release the next beta. This is included. It should happen within a week.
    3. Apologies if directions aren't right here as I have the new beta and can't recall where this stuff was on the old one or if it was a feature. There is a scale at the bottom left of the screen. As well, there is the measure menu - ruler looking thing second from the left in the top bar.
    4. Not 100% sure what you mean here. You can edit tracks made on computer by right clicking. If you're talking about syncing between the app and computer, that happens automatically. If you're talking about editing a track you made on the app on your computer, click on your email address on the upper left and open the my tracks page.

    All the best,
    Ro

  18. rmarcucci closed this discussion on 27 Feb, 2020 02:30 PM.

  19. ecojoy re-opened this discussion on 28 Feb, 2020 11:08 PM

  20. 10 Posted by ecojoy on 28 Feb, 2020 11:08 PM

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    Hi Rom,

    Very cool. That directional arrow is a key component to successful navigation. Hope the arrow is distinct to see with aged eyes (Gaia’s is not).

    Let me know when the next release. Plan to start hiking on the 6th of March. Would like to update as long as it will not require reloading maps, etc.

    Haven’t found the distance measure to be so helpful, but a CLEAR scale on the side of the map would be very helpful-as is done with Garmin. Gaia is too light to see (again, developing for aged eyes would be helpful)

    Found the map under “tracks” Nice!

    Cheers
    David

  21. Support Staff 11 Posted by Ben Lantow on 01 Mar, 2020 07:26 PM

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    We released the updates today. You don't need to download your tiles again, it will preserve them from the prior versions. We added scale and compass to this release. Check out display options and turn on heading line if you're having issues with the arrow.

  22. Ben Lantow closed this discussion on 01 Mar, 2020 07:26 PM.

  23. Patty Duffy re-opened this discussion on 01 Mar, 2020 08:09 PM

  24. 12 Posted by Patty Duffy on 01 Mar, 2020 08:09 PM

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    What is the release number so I know that I am running the most up to date version?! Thank you!

  25. 13 Posted by ecojoy on 01 Mar, 2020 08:11 PM

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    Thank You Ben!

    You guys rock!!!

    How does one update the Caltopo mobile?

    Cheers

    David

  26. 14 Posted by ecojoy on 01 Mar, 2020 10:21 PM

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    Thank you!

     

    From: Patty Duffy [mailto:[email blocked]]
    Sent: Sunday, March 1, 2020 12:22
    To: [email blocked]
    Subject: Re: how to get Gaia and Caltopo to play nice? [Cal/SARTopo Offline #474]

     

    Go to the App Store and search CalTopo. It should say “update”

     

    On Sun, Mar 1, 2020 at 12:11 PM David Burdick <[email blocked] <mailto:[email blocked]> > wrote:

    Thank You Ben!

    You guys rock!!!

    How does one update the Caltopo mobile?

    Cheers

    David

  27. rmarcucci closed this discussion on 02 Mar, 2020 05:41 AM.

  28. ecojoy re-opened this discussion on 11 May, 2020 06:58 PM

  29. 15 Posted by ecojoy on 11 May, 2020 06:58 PM

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    Hi Ro,

    Struggling with something that should be very simple but not seeing how it can be done.

    I would like to upload my tracks recorded on my mobile caltopo beta to my desktop caltopo;.

    How do I do that?

    Where does the mobile app keep my tracks (file name)

    I look forward to your thoughts at your earliest convenience.

    Best

    David

    Ps used the latest beta on our hayduke route (350 miles). Worked well for Android, not so well for Iphone.

    Happy to share experience if you are interested

  30. Support Staff 16 Posted by Julie on 11 May, 2020 09:51 PM

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    Hi David,

    First let's make sure that you have synced both your mobile device as well as your Desktop CalTopo. In the app, navigate using the main menu to Your Account, and hit "Sync Now."

    For the Desktop, follow these instructions: https://help.caltopo.com/kb/caltopo-desktop-formerly-offline/deskto...

    Then you should be able to go to your account in the Desktop app (click "offline user" again) and click on the tab at the top for either "Your Tracks" or for "Your Maps" if you had the tracks saved to a specific map.

    If you still can't find it, let me know and we can go about it another way.

    Thanks,
    Julie

  31. Julie closed this discussion on 11 May, 2020 09:51 PM.

  32. rmarcucci re-opened this discussion on 12 May, 2020 01:04 AM

  33. Support Staff 17 Posted by rmarcucci on 12 May, 2020 01:04 AM

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    David,

    Sorry, I think there was a little confusion regarding the wording in your inquiry.

    Assuming the app has been synced, tracks on your computer can be found by clicking on your email in the upper left, then the your tracks tab. I see many on your account. If you recorded them to an already existing map (your Hayduke map as an example), they will appear as objects on that map.

    On your app, click the upper left 3 bars, your tracks.

    We would definitely like to hear about your experience with the app on the Hayduke and why it didn't work as well on iOS.

    Thank you,
    Rom

  34. 18 Posted by Patty Duffy on 12 May, 2020 04:36 PM

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    Hi Rom, I was David’s hiking partner on the Hayduke. I used CalTopo on my iPhone. The biggest and most frustrating issue was the lag time in getting the app to open and then show our current location by GPS. It was dramatically slower than David’s Samsung . It was also significantly slower than GaiaGPS. It was also very frustrating that the app would not stay open after my screen timed out. I realize some of this was done to save battery usage and CalTopo did use less battery than GaiaGPS but it was a huge hinderance for us nevertheless and I would have scarified SOME battery usage to be able to more readily access the app. For instance, there were multiple times on cross-country sections that we needed to double check our location multiple times in a matter of just a few minutes to confirm the proper entry location down into a steep canyon. Each time the app closed it would take approximately 15 seconds to reload and then sometimes another 15-20 seconds to bring up the GPS location. That doesn’t seem like a lot of time but these lags add up. FWIW, I also had all labels turned off to improve loading time. I made this complaint before my trip when testing the app and was told that I needed to check my settings for battery usage. But the iPhone doesn’t have any such power use settings like the Samsung that would cause the app to close each time. Gaia GPS does not do this (and yes, it was a big file, but GaiaGPS had no problem with the file size). If you know of a setting that affects this, please point it out to me. Otherwise, I would encourage CalTopo to look into this situation and improve on it. It definitely caused me to use GaiaGPS more in instances of frequent use in a small time period. However, I like CalTopo far better than GaiaGPS….the biggest difference being that the markers can be more varied and their size is not so overwhelming on the map as in GaiaGPS.

    I do have hopes to be back on the trail for another cross-country trip later this summer and would be thrilled to do further testing of the app if you are willing to make some modifications. I am also happy to give more specifics if anything I mentioned isn’t clear or if you want to hone in on a specific area. I appreciate you taking interest in the difficulties I had.

    Patty Duffy

  35. 19 Posted by ecojoy on 12 May, 2020 06:34 PM

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    Hi Rom,

    Thanks for your help on uploading the maps. I think there might be some need to put this info on the web. There may be some obsolete info out there now.

     

    Patty mentioned her issues with Caltopo. The system worked well for me, and I liked the long line that is used to help point the way and orientate the map. It’s still tough to determine distances, as the line is faint for my old eyes, but there is a nice system to draw a line and determine distance, and I used that.

    Would be nice if:

    1. There was a way to click on a point on a route and for it to tell you how many trail miles it is away (simular to Guthook, although I think Guthook uses linear as the crow flies distance.

    2. Elevation gain and loss to be indicated on a section of a track about to be hiked

    3. Tracking done intermittently even on “medium power savings” power mode settings. When set to “optimized”, it tracks continuously but uses up too much power. When set to medium, it only registers a point when you check your map. (a good example is the purple line https://caltopo.com/m/M9QK. The first 3 hours the phone was set to optimized, and a good track established-after that, set to medium, and only made track points when I checked the map

     

    Hope that helps!

    Best

    David

  36. 20 Posted by Patty Duffy on 12 May, 2020 08:16 PM

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    Oh, one other thing I think is important to share. GaiaGPS has a NatGeo layer which is really, really nice for hiking in National Parks and other areas that Trails Illustrated works with National Geographic in putting out those maps. I’d love to see that in CalTopo!

  37. 21 Posted by ecojoy on 12 May, 2020 08:23 PM

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    Thanks Julie,

    That seemed to work!

    Might be some outdated info on the caltopo site regarding this question

    Cheers

    David

  38. Support Staff 22 Posted by Ben Lantow on 13 May, 2020 12:05 AM

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    Hi there,
    Bummer on the iPhone front. All of those issues are fixed between the current release and the next release. We totally reworked the application startup, we reworked how it behaves in the background (it doesn't shut down the app nearly as frequently), though iOS doesn't have a setting and does sometimes close apps, but with the improved startup profile you shouldn't continue to see such significant lag.

    As for the things David said:
    1. If you click on measure distance and click the point it will do exactly what you were looking for, tell you how far the point is.
    2. That is under profile for that track, shows you distance and gain/loss
    3. This unfortunately was actually most likely a coincidence, if you used battery saver on your phone that would describe the behaviour that would occur. The medium track setting does not cause it to only record when the app is open. I would ensure you don't use the phone's "battery saver" setting since it restricts access to GPS

    We have were trying to work to obtain that mapping data from National Geographic and I've been unable to reach anyone there lately.

    Best,
    Ben

  39. Ben Lantow closed this discussion on 13 May, 2020 12:05 AM.

  40. Patty Duffy re-opened this discussion on 13 May, 2020 01:24 AM

  41. 23 Posted by Patty Duffy on 13 May, 2020 01:24 AM

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    Excellent to hear this. When is the next release?!

  42. Support Staff 24 Posted by Ben Lantow on 20 May, 2020 07:15 PM

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    Just pushed it for approval today, should be seeing it in the next 3 or so days!

    Ben

  43. Ben Lantow closed this discussion on 20 May, 2020 07:15 PM.

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